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Russell Letson
`Olu`olu
USA
504 Posts |
 Posted - 02/17/2004 : 2:56:29 PM
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A fellow forumite at Ezboard's Acoustic Guitar Talk, Talk, Talk is looking for a title for what he's calling "a quasi Hawaiian slack key original tune." He'd like to call it "One Key Slack" in Hawaiian, since it's in drop-D but can't find a source that will help with the translation.
I answered this way: From my Hawaiian dictionary, the word for "one" in the sense of "only" or "alone" seems to be "kahi." I don't know the rules for assembling phrases like this, but you might start with "Kahi Ki Ho`alu" and hope that putting these elements together this way would make sense to a Hawaiian. (It's possible that what I've suggested winds up meaning "slack key played alone" or "the one-and-only slack key.")
Does anyone with actual competence in the area have any suggestions?
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Reid
Ha`aha`a
Andorra
1526 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2004 : 1:51:03 PM
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Rusell, do you mean that he wants it to mean that only one string was slacked, i.e., the 6th string to D?
So, a gloss might be: "One Slacked String"?
I suppose Sarah will come up with something, but, at the risk of offending, it sounds like a pretty lame excuse for a title - this is Reid The Art Critic's view, of course. Isn't there something else about the song that has some meaning to him? Then again, Leonard could never come up with a title, which is why we have so many "Opihi..." title variants; all meaningless.
...Reid |
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Mark
Ha`aha`a
USA
1628 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2004 : 2:06:54 PM
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Then again, Leonard could never come up with a title, which is why we have so many "Opihi..." title variants; all meaningless.
Not so. There's a deep (and rather salacious) story behind all the "Opihi" titles.
Yrs for truth and beauty,
Mark |
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Russell Letson
`Olu`olu
USA
504 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2004 : 9:18:32 PM
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Reid: Yup, I think he wants to indicate the tune's minimal qualification for slack-key status, and I take it to be a mark of humility (and sense of humor).
Mark: You mean a kaona beneath the kaona offered in Jay Junker's liner notes? Well, I swan! I've just been working on the Leonard section of Aloha Guitar, trying to decide how much of that material I need to include--especially since I suspect that the meanings were constructed long after the tunes were composed and given titles by Don McDiarmid, Noelani Mahoe, and Margaret Williams.
Imagine having to come up with a kaona for "Slack Key #1," "Slack Key #2," and so on. Maybe something out of accounting.
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Sarah
`Olu`olu
571 Posts |
Posted - 02/19/2004 : 8:18:37 PM
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Aloha mai e Russell,
E kala mai i ka'u pane lohi 'ana... {pls excuse my tardy reply}
Interesting question you raise with this title, "One Key Slack" -- interesting because in English, it has a "double meaning" and is thus tricky to provide a translation for. The double meaing I see is 1) one string is slackened, and 2) it's a slack key piece called "one key" because only one string is slackened; both of which are true.
You're right that kahi indicates one; but to indicate a single, only one, alone (as it were) and single numerically, ho'okahi is used. Your thought of Kahi Ki Ho'alu would mean, I believe, One Slack Key. Now, that is kinda what this fellow is doing: one slack key. But it's not the title he was hoping for: One Key Slack.
From what I know, "One Key Slack" would be "'Alu Ho'okahi Ki" -- "a single key [in the state of being] slack". This misses, however, the hook of the familiar phrase ki ho'alu.
I'm going out on a limb, but a compromise might be, Ho'okahi Ki Ho'alu. Whereby you have "A Single Slack Key," or, "Slacken a Single Key". If I am right, "Ho'okahi Ki Ho'alu" might be taken both ways by a Hawaiian speaker; in a similar way that the English "One Key Slack" has those two meanings.
Lastly, hapa is a word for part, or partial. Your description of the piece as a "quasi Slack key" piece made me think of this: "Hapa Ki Ho'alu" – Partial Slack Key... and kinda a mixed genre, too :-)
Hope these observations are of some help.
Aloha,
Sarah |
Edited by - Sarah on 02/24/2004 12:56:25 PM |
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Russell Letson
`Olu`olu
USA
504 Posts |
Posted - 02/20/2004 : 11:07:02 AM
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Thanks, Sarah--I've posted a link to this thread on the TTT forum. Anybody else have a suggestion?
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Douglas23d
Aloha
USA
19 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2004 : 7:06:06 PM
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This thread is interesting because it deals with translation of Hawaiian Language in the form of understandable english context, flow or format. I am by no means an expert on our language (Hawaiian or English), but consider the following.
Through Hawaiian Immersion I've learned that the item we are talking about, comes first, because it is most important. So when we say Ki Ho'alu... we are actually saying Key Slacked, Slackened or Slack. For the benefit of english translation, we then say Slack Key.
Does it follow then that we might say Ki Ho'alu Hapa to mean, Key slackened partially (literal translation)? Or, Partially Slackened Key (English translation)
Trust me, this is more of a question than a statement of fact.
Aloha Kakou |
Doug
Perpetuate the Music of Your Culture, for in the Music, the Story is told. |
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Sarah
`Olu`olu
571 Posts |
Posted - 02/25/2004 : 09:58:44 AM
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Aloha e Douglas,
You are right, usually the modifier follows the subject talked about. There are exceptions (oh no!), however, certain words that do precede their subject (or, rarely, have a different meaning when they come before rather than after). The ones I can think of off the top of my head are terms of quantity. For instance, one can say, "'eono moku" [six islands] or "nä moku 'eono" [the six islands]. One would not say, "nä 'eono moku", unless you meant something like "the island sixes" - perhaps the name of a band :-)
In the case of the word hapa, I was going on the principle of the common usage of hapa to signify part. You can find in the dictionary several entries where hapa comes first in the phrase:
hapaha, hapakolu, hapalua (and other fractions)
hapa haole [part-white person, etc.]
hapa nui [most]
hapa makahiki [semiannual]
hapa 'u'uku [small portion]
I don't know enough to really have a definitive word on your suggestion, however.
Maybe someone else can chime in with some ideas about the use of hapa before and after a word.
aloha,
Sarah
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Douglas23d
Aloha
USA
19 Posts |
Posted - 02/25/2004 : 4:18:29 PM
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Mahalo Sarah!
Once again, so interesting!! And I continue to learn.
Aloha, |
Doug
Perpetuate the Music of Your Culture, for in the Music, the Story is told. |
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Sarah
`Olu`olu
571 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2004 : 09:07:03 AM
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Aloha e Doug,
I looked in the "big" dictionary, and found a single example of hapa after a subject: "ka 'ike hapa," defined as "partial knowledge."
I'm gonna be keeping my eye out for other examples 
aloha,
Sarah |
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